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May 20 Site Update

 
    • Babs_05 disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h07
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crypto-fascism

    no need to be so rude, Hoxerijo

    • mvordeme disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h14
    Hoxerijo said:
    I've seen a moderator which is proudly a crypto-fascist.
    Babs_05 said:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crypto-fascism
    Which means that somebody who lets on about being a crypto-fascist is either pulling your leg or really stupid.

    • Hoxerijo disse...
    • Usuário
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h21
    World is full of stupids, or legalized criminals never get rich. Face it. Neonazist party in Netherland make a great feast after his 14% and say thanks also to Cryptofascists and their exposure of nazist and fascist symbols.

    It italy we say "things enter in your ass, but not in your head".

    Those cryptofascists are 50% left-wing idiots and 50% happy fascists. The left wing because they cure a wino giving him a bottle of whisky. The fascists because they know that the greatest part of the people look at the pictures without reading.

    Editado por Hoxerijo em Jun 5 2009, 12h23
  • This thread is about May 20 not April 20. Please stop that! There's nothing to say against some cynical analysis from time to time, but this goes too far.

    • Babs_05 disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h24
    Maybe it's time for this thread to be locked? It's not heading anywhere good...

    • Hoxerijo disse...
    • Usuário
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h26
    Yes, why bother people with real facts about life? Let's speak about boobs and football championship. Let's get teenagers for life.

    Anyway, I don't want to disturb the sleepers anymore. Go on with pathetic request to CBS, and excuse me if I dare to think in the Moron Age.

    • mvordeme disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 12h56
    Go away with the truth about life. There are enough people queuing at my door on Saturdays who want to tell me the truth. Boobs are better. :-x

    • Babs_05 disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 13h00
    mvordeme said:
    There are enough people queuing at my door on Saturdays who want to tell me the truth.
    They are the only people I actually swear out loud to. I am perfectly capable of thinking for myself. ;-)

  • Free Tracks List, Lookin' Good

    Back on actual topic, the promised improvement to free track display makes them nice and obvious on the artist pages, thanks!

    Example page for anyone who hasn't seen it yet, the Scarring Party

  • Babs_05 said:
    ahem. one of my pet peeves... ; )

    In the past, when we went to the Groups page, (I can't remember what it said up top) first we saw a page half showing people listening now, and below that, the most recent journals. From there, we could go on to the Groups page. There, we could see sponsored groups and new groups (like now), but we also saw groups now active. That got me active in a lot of groups.

    The absence of that feature has decimated groups, imo.

    The other thing is the way groups are organised in our Profiles. We have fewer per page and there's no way to search. So groups are effectively out of bounds if you have more than a couple of pages' worth.
    This really gets my goat. Not only the way groups are organized in our profiles, but also the way the friends list is organized too.

    For the library, we can use "jump to", recently added, or an alphabetical listing to navigate. What about a feature that lets us choose the number to be displayed per page? That seems to be the norm on the internets, no?

    What about a choice between an icon view and a list view? For the friends list, this list view is available through the client, but it'd be great to have it through the profile too.

    While I'm on it, I really miss the "now listening" that used to be on the listen, now radio, page that showed 10 random people that were active on the site. The vast majority of my musical discoveries came from checking out what those random people were listening to.

  • This thread is getting nowhere.

    The suspected believes of volunteer moderators on this site and the choices the paid staff make have nothing to do with each other. If anyone has issues with a moderator, feel free to contact that mod, another moderator or a staffmember about that, not hi-jack a thread with accusations based upon your believes.
    There is another site for that.

    Remember to say "thank you" for the things you haven't had
    System Status (indication) - Problems scrobbling FAQ - The Last.FM FAQ
    Do you spot incorrect auto-corrections? You can flag them at the artist/track-page.
  • WTF

    THIS IS STUPID, i want to listen to an artist music, this is a step backwards definately, instead of having all the songs conveniently placed in a player on the main page, why not separate them all so you have to go to a different page to listen to each song! you guys are geniuses!

    • app103 disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 5 2009, 23h31
    Russ said:
    Babs_05 said:
    There are two questions going round in my mind:
    1) where did this decision come from when it goes against everything


    It came from us. We have to make last.fm cost-efficient. We can't just sit here wasting money any more - the days of the web 2.0 boom are gone, and advertising revenues have plummeted.



    I can understand that, but at the same time, I hope you can understand that what you are doing will cause your paid subscribers to say the same thing.

    I could understand doing this to the free listeners, but people paying need to feel there is a value in what they are paying for.

    I didn't have to subscribe. I didn't have to pay. I use this service primarily to discover things that are freely available, full song downloads, many are CC licensed.

    I paid to support that. I feel the exposure you give these artists is wonderful, and despite the fact I am dirt poor, I scraped together some cash to support the free music I have been downloading from here. I consider my subscription a donation to support you, because you have been supporting unknown artists.

    I frequently link to pages on your site, giving you a lot more page views than you could ever get from just me. How many people have come to last.fm and become paid subscribers, after initially coming to this site through one of my links, I will never know, but I can name at least 3 in the last few months that I managed to convince to open their wallets and make a "donation" for the same reasons that I did.

    So you make money from my page views, money from the page views of those I send here, money directly from my pocket in the form of a paid subscription (yearly, not monthly), and from subscriptions of those that sign up and pay after I send them here.

    How much money will you lose when people like me start to think they are "wasting money"? You are doing a dis-service to the artists that you once were helping a whole lot more. You are erasing the reasons why I became a subscriber.

    Please don't make me regret spending the money to become a paid subscriber.


    My short and long tail are:
    • akrde disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 6 2009, 10h11

    Re: Free Tracks List, Lookin' Good

    dianashamilton said:
    Back on actual topic, the promised improvement to free track display makes them nice and obvious on the artist pages, thanks!


    Yes ok, looks good, but this is only a rotten compromise to the removed player on the artist and album pages! (in particular for people who are not interested in free tracks at all and i guess they will be the majority)

  • Is it just me, or is the player on myspace artist pages down too for over a week now?

    • DFA1979 disse...
    • Moderador
    • Jun 6 2009, 12h10
    HodgeStar said:
    Is it just me, or is the player on myspace artist pages down too for over a week now?
    Just you, I think. (it was working fine for me last night, anyway)

  • ah thanks. then it must be something on my end. i see only an empty area where the player normally should be.

    • mvordeme disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 6 2009, 13h39
    Installed NoScript per chance?

  • i'd cleared the flash cookies last week and that somehow defused the myspace player. I could fix it. So just a coincidence and wrong conclusions on my part. sorry and thanks for your sympathies :)

    • disse...
    • Usuário
    • Jun 6 2009, 18h08

    Story

    To the last.fm guys:
    I think this move is bad. I posted about a month the same and I received a reply that the way ads revenue works is related to geography, but that approach works in the old media model (have you ever listened a Spanish ad in a German FM radio?). Nowadays, you can have this, if you know your users.
    Due to your old ad revenue model, you decided to give the service free to three countries where the money is good, and the rest has to pay.
    Now your brand is not popular in the rest of the world. Have you measured this? not being popular in the rest of the world? You will see it when you analyse the monthly growth rate and, of course, leave rate since your announcement. I guess you will never publish the figures...
    What you do not understand is social networks are more emotional and viral and they do not care about your cost structure or what ever reason you may have to stop providing a service for free. This is bad PR in social networking.

    I guess the future would be like this, if you are not able to get good numbers by every end of year. If I was the owner:
    - Not able to get a decent earnings ratio.
    - Not popular, not cool
    - No user base growth.
    - Expensive office location.
    - Staff in the expensive location (30 or more * avg. salary in London)
    Maths and conclusion?

    If you are able to succeed or not, for me is the same. I live in Germany, but I do not agree with you and I will cancel my account soon. Your case might be used in future for education: how not to ruin a relationship with your users in a social network environment.

    • dankine disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 6 2009, 18h10

    Re: Story

    okolico said:
    To the last.fm guys:
    I think this move is bad. I posted about a month the same and I received a reply that the way ads revenue works is related to geography, but that approach works in the old media model (have you ever listened a Spanish ad in a German FM radio?). Nowadays, you can have this, if you know your users.
    Due to your old ad revenue model, you decided to give the service free to three countries where the money is good, and the rest has to pay.
    Now your brand is not popular in the rest of the world. Have you measured this? not being popular in the rest of the world? You will see it when you analyse the monthly growth rate and, of course, leave rate since your announcement. I guess you will never publish the figures...
    What you do not understand is social networks are more emotional and viral and they do not care about your cost structure or what ever reason you may have to stop providing a service for free. This is bad PR in social networking.

    I guess the future would be like this, if you are not able to get good numbers by every end of year. If I was the owner:
    - Not able to get a decent earnings ratio.
    - Not popular, not cool
    - No user base growth.
    - Expensive office location.
    - Staff in the expensive location (30 or more * avg. salary in London)
    Maths and conclusion?

    If you are able to succeed or not, for me is the same. I live in Germany, but I do not agree with you and I will cancel my account soon. Your case might be used in future for education: how not to ruin a relationship with your users in a social network environment.


    well done for turning up late, and posting in the wrong thread. you're obviously a legend.

    'Maybe living and dying are the same thing, maybe the fact that we turn them into two different things is why we feel so lost.'

    Help with Auto corrections
  • I don't get half the complaints here.

    Personally I couldn't care less about the player on artist pages, I understand more about not having it on album pages being an inconvenience for those who actually used the feature to listen to entire albums.

    I may be wrong but I was under the impression that for the big label stuff, at least in the US, that it cost more to stream on-demand stuff than the radio stuff and to be considered radio there had to be X number of tracks from X different artists. Either way I never viewed these players that play a list to be radio, I viewed them as on-demand.

    Usually if I am listening to the radio, it is recommended radio or neighborhood radio the larger percent of the time, with a smaller amount of time listening to tag radio, group radio or artist radio. The whole time these players that play from a list have been on the artist and album pages, I've probably used them less than a half a dozen times. Usually I will go to an album page and listen to individual tracks. If there are no albums for an artist I will look through the full listing of tracks, usually if there are tracks with full plays they will be among the tracks with higher play counts, so listed earlier in the listings.

    Much of the time that I am connected to Last FM, I'm not even streaming music, I'm listening to it locally, checking my tags, looking at recent activity on my favorite tags, looking at other peoples libraries who use the the same tags, etc...

    Maybe it's just the way I use the site, I don't understand the view that having the player on artist and album pages affects discovery.

    For the artists that want to get there stuff in the hands of the listeners the trade of for not having the player is better visibility of freely downloadable tracks. So I don't get the whole 'This is going to kill free music on Last FM' argument either.

    My contribution to the list of groups dedicated to creating tags.....

    Genre-free tags!

    Later, Seeker

    My short and long tail are:



    • Babs_05 disse...
    • Assinante
    • Jun 7 2009, 16h33
    ^^ Seeker is The Master.

    Absent players from artist / album / track players is inconvenient, absolutely. It's got jack to do with music discovery. You already know what you want when you use these players. They are on-demand, correct, and therefore the most expensive to run. (fingers crossed should the economy improve, Last.fm reinstate them).

    Streaming is: similar artist radio, global tag radio, personal tag radio, playlist, your recommended by Last.fm, neighbour radio, group radio (and any other I might have forgotten) where you don't know what will play next. That's your music discovery, alongside all the information throughout the site which is available to all, registered or not.

    Speaking for myself, I don't organise anything in my iTunes. That's my album stash only. I use Last.fm as a springboard to more music. So far, I've barely looked at my Last.fm recommended because my friends, groups, my own curiosity haven't given me the chance! I'm up to date with new releases, I'm more in-depth with old stuff I always wanted to know more about, I've been surprised by stuff new to me. All discovered here. And mostly by tag cloud hopping or through conversation. If anything, I would want the tag clouds back where they used to be, where the players just were. Go on, Last.fm. Pleeeeeease.

  • Babs_05 said:
    ...I would want the tag clouds back where they used to be, where the players just were. Go on, Last.fm. Pleeeeeease.
    YES!!!1!11 and since someone already has admitted that the player in its current form is kinda pointless when it's supposed to play only one song, tag clouds on track pages too please. Put the videos back where they belong - the third row.

    • BenV disse...
    • Usuário
    • Jun 8 2009, 7h31
    As a last.fm user of 4 years this decision to remove the player from artist pages has really crippled the user experience for me. When I look up a recommended artist, the first thing I do is listen to the song previews to get a feel for the band. If I dig it then there's a good chance I'll buy a few tracks from that artist, otherwise I'll move on.

    I can understand how licensing fees from big label artists are a considerable financial burden, but why not just disable the player for those specific artists and leave it active for the more obscure groups. Or better yet, make it a feature for subscribers. Believe it or not I would happily pay a small monthly fee to be able to get this feature back.

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