Automated & manual Artist disambiguation: How to drastically improve this site,…

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- bandaslasher disse...
- Usuário
- Jun 14 2011, 18h39
And there we go... no news as usual... I'll be back in 2 years... see you guys!...

Slasher - Thrash Metal
+55-19-8133.6922
slasher@slasher.com.br
www.slasher.com.br

[quote][b][user]bandaslasher[/user][/b] disse: And there we go... no news as usual... I'll be back in 2 years... see you guys!...[quote]

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- kitsueb disse...
- Usuário
- Jun 16 2011, 17h09
もう

I just tried playing the recommended radio again, and for about the fifth try in ~= 6Mo. it is completely useless. Maybe it really is suggesting bands that I would be interested in, but I'll never know because it plays tracks from some other artist!

In my mind separating artists is really simple, just do it on a per album basis! Really recommendations and similarity should be on a per-album basis too. How many of you know good bands that have put out one bad album, or one hit wonders with only one album worth listening to?

How the artist keys are handled in Last.fm's database really doesn't matter to me. Just pick a system and setup disambiguation pages like Wikipedia for finding specific artist and give your users some way to split existing pages.

The way it is now all of Last.fm's recommendation and radio services are worthless to me.

At this point the album/artist/track logging really isn't a very compelling reason to keep using this service.

[quote][b][user]kitsueb[/user][/b] disse: I just tried playing the recommended radio again, and for about the fifth try in ~= 6Mo. it is completely useless. Maybe it really is suggesting bands that I would be interested in, but I'll never know because it plays tracks from some other artist! In my mind separating artists is really simple, just do it on a per album basis! Really recommendations and similarity should be on a per-album basis too. How many of you know good bands that have put out one bad album, or one hit wonders with only one album worth listening to? How the artist keys are handled in Last.fm's database really doesn't matter to me. Just pick a system and setup disambiguation pages like Wikipedia for finding specific artist and give your users some way to split existing pages. The way it is now all of Last.fm's recommendation and radio services are worthless to me. At this point the album/artist/track logging really isn't a very compelling reason to keep using this service.[quote]

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- so77o disse...
- Usuário
- Jun 16 2011, 21h17
Death bands issue

lastfm need to make a distinction with this 2 bands! like "Death (Punk)" "Death (Metal)" ... simple... but make some distinction for both Death http://www.lastfm.es/music/Death

ROCK YOU DAY!!!
dxoD

[quote][b][user]so77o[/user][/b] disse: lastfm need to make a distinction with this 2 bands! like "Death (Punk)" "Death (Metal)" ... simple... but make some distinction for both [artist]Death[/artist][url=http://www.lastfm.es/music/Death]http://www.lastfm.es/music/Death[/url][quote]

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- Hairymuffin2011 disse...
- Usuário
- Jun 17 2011, 12h14
I really don't see how this would be difficult to do. Isn't it just a simple case of looking up the the song name against the artist and scrobbling to the appropriate artist page. It's highly unlikely artists sharing the same name would also have songs named the same. Or even allow users to manually tag songs to the appropriate artist page, and after a while, once the system has "learned" which song belongs to whom, this tagging won't even be necessary.

Just my two pence - feel free to slap my ignorant and uninformed arse down as you please!

[quote][b][user]Hairymuffin2011[/user][/b] disse: I really don't see how this would be difficult to do. Isn't it just a simple case of looking up the the song name against the artist and scrobbling to the appropriate artist page. It's highly unlikely artists sharing the same name would also have songs named the same. Or even allow users to manually tag songs to the appropriate artist page, and after a while, once the system has "learned" which song belongs to whom, this tagging won't even be necessary. Just my two pence - feel free to slap my ignorant and uninformed arse down as you please! [quote]

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- Sekir disse...
- Assinante
- Jun 17 2011, 12h31
Solution is not big issue. Biggest issue is realisation of any possible solutions.
Too many work for too small staff.

Админы ластфм - казлы.

[quote][b][user]Sekir[/user][/b] disse: Solution is not big issue. Biggest issue is realisation of any possible solutions. Too many work for too small staff. [quote]

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- spineshank155 disse...
- Usuário
- Jun 17 2011, 16h48
Hairymuffin2011 said:
Isn't it just a simple case of looking up the the song name against the artist and scrobbling to the appropriate artist page. It's highly unlikely artists sharing the same name would also have songs named the same.

Actually there are artists who share the same song titles.

Most people that scrobble an artist for the first time may notice 'another' artist & most of the time when more users scrobble them they'll want to fix the page correctly so i think it's a simple flag, tag & editing that users will be willing to do. Once it's in the system it should realize what they are scrobbling by time, track name, track number, genre, & album title. If it's not scrobbling correclty the user should be allowed to fix that problem on his/her own if needed.

^{Kill Money, Improve life on earth. Join: The Venus Project The Zeitgeist Movement}

[quote][b][user]spineshank155[/user][/b] disse: [quote][b][user]Hairymuffin2011[/user][/b] said: Isn't it just a simple case of looking up the the song name against the artist and scrobbling to the appropriate artist page. It's highly unlikely artists sharing the same name would also have songs named the same. [/quote] Actually there are artists who share the same song titles. Most people that scrobble an artist for the first time may notice 'another' artist & most of the time when more users scrobble them they'll want to fix the page correctly so i think it's a simple flag, tag & editing that users will be willing to do. Once it's in the system it should realize what they are scrobbling by time, track name, track number, genre, & album title. If it's not scrobbling correclty the user should be allowed to fix that problem on his/her own if needed. [quote]

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- dcarter_za disse...
- Usuário
- Ago 8 2011, 0h32
iTranscendence I think you're spot on with this and have even provided a good solution to the problem.

Confusion of bands is not just an irritation when looking up information, but the recommendation features are horribly broken because of it.

It's been over 2 years since you started this thread and this issue seems to have got no closer to being resolved. Last.fm please make this a priority.

[quote][b][user]dcarter_za[/user][/b] disse: iTranscendence I think you're spot on with this and have even provided a good solution to the problem. Confusion of bands is not just an irritation when looking up information, but the recommendation features are horribly broken because of it. It's been over 2 years since you started this thread and this issue seems to have got no closer to being resolved. Last.fm please make this a priority. [quote]

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- liamers disse...
- Usuário
- Ago 30 2011, 14h11
bumping. the lack of response is ridicules! At this rate it's only a matter if time until someone creates a site like last fm but without this annoying problem and with better user relations

[quote][b][user]liamers[/user][/b] disse: bumping. the lack of response is ridicules! At this rate it's only a matter if time until someone creates a site like last fm but without this annoying problem and with better user relations[quote]

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- Sekir disse...
- Assinante
- Ago 30 2011, 19h15
liamers said:
bumping. the lack of response is ridicules! At this rate it's only a matter if time until someone creates a site like last fm but without this annoying problem and with better user relations
What kind of response do you need?

Админы ластфм - казлы.

[quote][b][user]Sekir[/user][/b] disse: [quote][b][user]liamers[/user][/b] said: bumping. the lack of response is ridicules! At this rate it's only a matter if time until someone creates a site like last fm but without this annoying problem and with better user relations[/quote] What kind of response do you need? [quote]

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- Feminism disse...
- Usuário
- Set 9 2011, 10h14
Here's the megathread I was looking for. Make it happen, Last.fm.

我が名は「グラマー」。押して参る。『ア・ラ～ハクメン』

[quote][b][user]Feminism[/user][/b] disse: Here's the megathread I was looking for. Make it happen, Last.fm.[quote]

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- Wilwa disse...
- Usuário
- Set 9 2011, 10h22
It would be lovely it this were able to be solved. It's really frustrating.

[quote][b][user]Wilwa[/user][/b] disse: It would be lovely it this were able to be solved. It's really frustrating. [quote]

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- iTranscendence disse...
- Usuário
- Set 28 2011, 3h22
4 months without a login

And nothing of value was lost.

[quote][b][user]iTranscendence[/user][/b] disse: And nothing of value was lost.[quote]

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- snyde1 disse...
- Assinante
- Dez 22 2011, 3h37
I wanted to pull this closer to where people look at it, and remind folks that the musicbrainz ids hold promise.

Did I hear that right? Mondegreens - for the misheard word.
Like Odds? Can't get better than Even Odds!

Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even to the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story.

[quote][b][user]snyde1[/user][/b] disse: I wanted to pull this closer to where people look at it, and remind folks that the [url=http://blog.last.fm/2011/11/24/the-brainz-are-back-in-town]musicbrainz ids[/url] hold promise.[quote]

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- bandaslasher disse...
- Usuário
- Jan 14 2012, 3h39
is someone really working on it?

I can't believe it... :)

Slasher - Thrash Metal
+55-19-8133.6922
slasher@slasher.com.br
www.slasher.com.br

[quote][b][user]bandaslasher[/user][/b] disse: I can't believe it... :)[quote]

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- HumHumXX disse...
- Usuário
- Jan 31 2012, 2h22
FWIW

http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/MusicBrainz_Summit/2012_Mini-Summit/Notes#last.fm_update

[quote][b][user]HumHumXX[/user][/b] disse: http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/MusicBrainz_Summit/2012_Mini-Summit/Notes#last.fm_update[quote]

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- rwitte disse...
- Assinante
- Jan 31 2012, 19h26
Thanks for the info, HumHumXX :)

recommended by rwitte <♪)
recommended to rwitte <♪)
Facebook Profile

[quote][b][user]rwitte[/user][/b] disse: Thanks for the info, HumHumXX :)[quote]

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- HumHumXX disse...
- Usuário
- Fev 1 2012, 2h28
*edit*

[quote][b][user]HumHumXX[/user][/b] disse: *edit*[quote]

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- DarkElvick disse...
- Usuário
- Fev 5 2012, 17h46
I just don't understand why we have so little control over our scrobbles... or things in general here on last.fm. I'm perfectly willing to do more "work" to get my library in order. If that would also benefit other people (the site as a whole), that would be even better.

I've been rescrobbling tracks after deleting them so I can fix my ghetto album scrobbles. So when I go to an artist's page and check my scrobbles it looks nice. With no duplicate albums. Also makes my album generator useful.

It's tedious. Sometimes it's a simple apostrophe missing that fucked up my scrobbles, or a special character. Or [Disc x] tags before I realized iTunes had a disc tag to use.

Sometimes a track will exist on so many albums that I'll have to rescrobble it on multiple albums just to fix one album that was split up. Like I need to do with some of my Heart plays.

Ugg...

And it's really annoying for there to be (as someone else mentioned) multiple versions of the same album uploaded on last.fm. Like...

Spiffy World
SpiffyWorld
Spiffy World [Disc 1]
Spiffy World [Disc 2]
Spiffy World (US)
Spiffy World [Deluxe]
Spiffy World (Deluxe Version)
Spiffy World (Special Edition)
SpiffyWorld (1 Bonus Tracks)

Made up example obviously. ALL versions of the SAME album should be on the same base page. With tabs to any special versions (Deluxe Edition, Anniversary Edition, International versions, Singles [if they share the name of the album, like Born To Die by Lana Del Rey]). Then show the different track listings on those tabs.

With discs separated like this instead of lumped together or separated into two stupid ass pages. :/
Disc 1
tracklist
Disc 2
tracklist

Then for those stupid iTunes exclusive song and things like that, either have some kind of message next to them, or put them in a separate section that has the message.

I can't even understand why there is NO WAY to even report fucked up tracklistings or album titles. :/ It's also annoying that we can't "anchor" an album to the artists' page that a label/artist hasn't uploaded for whatever reason. Being able to "anchor" tracks to an album's tracklisting would be great too.

As it is, unless it's uploaded it won't even appear on their page. You'll have to go through the scrobbler album link, your library or manually enter the album title to go to it's page. And the album isn't represented on the albums section on an artist page. So you don't really know what album(s) people are listening to.

Not to mention the benefits of going to a page thinking, "Damn, I miss this girl/guy/group/band. I wonder if they've released any music since I last listened to them". Then you can actually make sure you *see* all their albums/eps/mixtapes/etc and if you missed some.

I mean... take Lucy Schwartz. One album on her page. Yet she's released 2 albums, 2 EPs and a free live album. (as well as songs on various soundtracks) Based on her page, you'd think she wasn't putting out anything... but she is. Her most recent was one of her EPs last year.

/pointless rant that will change absolutely nothing

[quote][b][user]DarkElvick[/user][/b] disse: [color=purple]I just don't understand why we have so little control over our scrobbles... or things in general here on last.fm. I'm perfectly willing to do more "work" to get my library in order. If that would also benefit other people (the site as a whole), that would be even better. I've been rescrobbling tracks after deleting them so I can fix my ghetto album scrobbles. So when I go to an artist's page and check my scrobbles it looks nice. With no duplicate albums. Also makes my album generator useful. It's tedious. Sometimes it's a simple apostrophe missing that fucked up my scrobbles, or a special character. Or [Disc x] tags before I realized iTunes had a disc tag to use. Sometimes a track will exist on so many albums that I'll have to rescrobble it on multiple albums just to fix one album that was split up. Like I need to do with some of my [artist]Heart[/artist] plays. Ugg... And it's really annoying for there to be (as someone else mentioned) multiple versions of the same album uploaded on last.fm. Like... Spiffy World SpiffyWorld Spiffy World [Disc 1] Spiffy World [Disc 2] Spiffy World (US) Spiffy World [Deluxe] Spiffy World (Deluxe Version) Spiffy World (Special Edition) SpiffyWorld (1 Bonus Tracks) Made up example obviously. ALL versions of the SAME album should be on the same base page. With tabs to any special versions (Deluxe Edition, Anniversary Edition, International versions, Singles [if they share the name of the album, like Born To Die by Lana Del Rey]). Then show the different track listings on those tabs. With discs separated like this instead of lumped together or separated into two stupid ass pages. :/ [quote]Disc 1[/quote] tracklist [quote]Disc 2[/quote] tracklist Then for those stupid iTunes exclusive song and things like that, either have some kind of message next to them, or put them in a separate section that has the message. I can't even understand why there is NO WAY to even report fucked up tracklistings or album titles. :/ It's also annoying that we can't "anchor" an album to the artists' page that a label/artist hasn't uploaded for whatever reason. Being able to "anchor" tracks to an album's tracklisting would be great too. As it is, unless it's uploaded it won't even appear on their page. You'll have to go through the scrobbler album link, your library or manually enter the album title to go to it's page. And the album isn't represented on the albums section on an artist page. So you don't really know what album(s) people are listening to. Not to mention the benefits of going to a page thinking, "Damn, I miss this girl/guy/group/band. I wonder if they've released any music since I last listened to them". Then you can actually make sure you *see* all their albums/eps/mixtapes/etc and if you missed some. I mean... take [artist]Lucy Schwartz[/artist]. One album on her page. Yet she's released [b]2[/b] albums, 2 EPs and a free live album. (as well as songs on various soundtracks) Based on her page, you'd think she wasn't putting out anything... but she is. Her most recent was one of her EPs last year. /pointless rant that will change absolutely nothing[/color][quote]

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- Vaughn546 disse...
- Usuário
- Fev 6 2012, 8h24
I think you need to flesh out exactly how it be decided whether my scrobble of say

spam removed

[quote][b][user]Vaughn546[/user][/b] disse: I think you need to flesh out exactly how it be decided whether my scrobble of say [i]spam removed[/i][quote]
Editado por Babs_05 em Fev 19 2012, 2h04

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- iTranscendence disse...
- Usuário
- Fev 20 2012, 2h49
Been about 4 months again

I'll believe it when I see it.

Which I probably won't or care to take the time to find out anymore as it's really too little too late to drive me to involve myself in this site again.

[quote][b][user]iTranscendence[/user][/b] disse: I'll believe it when I see it. Which I probably won't or care to take the time to find out anymore as it's really too little too late to drive me to involve myself in this site again.[quote]

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- miyavocoil disse...
- Usuário
- Fev 24 2012, 18h23
spam

spam

[quote][b][user]miyavocoil[/user][/b] disse: spam[quote]
Editado por Babs_05 em Fev 25 2012, 3h12

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- tomstockmail disse...
- Usuário
- Mar 9 2012, 4h13
Was told to come here.

I was told to come here for the same-named artist problem. Where Last.FM isn't set up well enough to separate bands that have the same name.

>the devs is already actively working on a solution

That's what they said 3 years ago. Back to Pandora, everyone. Nothing to do here.

[quote][b][user]tomstockmail[/user][/b] disse: I was told to come here for the same-named artist problem. Where Last.FM isn't set up well enough to separate bands that have the same name. >the devs is already actively working on a solution That's what they said 3 years ago. Back to Pandora, everyone. Nothing to do here.[quote]

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- Couldtryharder disse...
- Equipe
- Mar 9 2012, 13h49
Hi Everyone,

those of you who follow closely will know that we've been working with Musicbrainz - see here http://www.last.fm/forum/21716/_/2022989/1 and here: http://blog.last.fm/2011/11/24/the-brainz-are-back-in-town

Adrian says at the end of that blog post that "we also hope to leverage MusicBrainz’s experience with handling artist and album disambiguation to improve how we model music on Last.fm"

So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results.

Thanks as ever for your patience, and for sticking with Last.fm.

[quote][b][user]Couldtryharder[/user][/b] disse: Hi Everyone, those of you who follow closely will know that we've been working with Musicbrainz - see here http://www.last.fm/forum/21716/_/2022989/1 and here: http://blog.last.fm/2011/11/24/the-brainz-are-back-in-town Adrian says at the end of that blog post that "we also hope to leverage MusicBrainz’s experience with handling artist and album disambiguation to improve how we model music on Last.fm" So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results. Thanks as ever for your patience, and for sticking with Last.fm.[quote]

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- tomstockmail disse...
- Usuário
- Mar 9 2012, 18h19
Couldtryharder said:
So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results.

This was said YEARS ago and there's still NO solution. A stop gap solution to prevent big problems such as bands from different countries with the same name would be to assume the users country/language is playing the matching band of their country.

See:
http://www.last.fm/music/Hurt

A US band, a Polish band. It can be pretty safe to assume that, when scrobbling, the US band is being played by people of the English language and particularly the United States, whereas Polish Hurt is more likely to be played by Polish speakers and people from Poland. It won't be a perfect solution but it will stop the two from being combined at least.

I can't even use Last.FM anymore because I get so much Polish crap thrown into my stations. Pandora doesn't have this problem, from the beginning.

[quote][b][user]tomstockmail[/user][/b] disse: [quote][b][user]Couldtryharder[/user][/b] said: So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results. [/quote] This was said YEARS ago and there's still NO solution. A stop gap solution to prevent big problems such as bands from different countries with the same name would be to assume the users country/language is playing the matching band of their country. See: http://www.last.fm/music/Hurt A US band, a Polish band. It can be pretty safe to assume that, when scrobbling, the US band is being played by people of the English language and particularly the United States, whereas Polish Hurt is more likely to be played by Polish speakers and people from Poland. It won't be a perfect solution but it will stop the two from being combined at least. I can't even use Last.FM anymore because I get so much Polish crap thrown into my stations. Pandora doesn't have this problem,[i] from the beginning.[/i][quote]

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- Sekir disse...
- Assinante
- Mar 9 2012, 19h12
Couldtryharder said:
Hi Everyone,

those of you who follow closely will know that we've been working with Musicbrainz - see here http://www.last.fm/forum/21716/_/2022989/1 and here: http://blog.last.fm/2011/11/24/the-brainz-are-back-in-town

Adrian says at the end of that blog post that "we also hope to leverage MusicBrainz’s experience with handling artist and album disambiguation to improve how we model music on Last.fm"

So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results.

Thanks as ever for your patience, and for sticking with Last.fm.

What does it remind me?
Yeah. Fingerprinting

tomstockmail said:

See:
http://www.last.fm/music/Hurt

A US band, a Polish band. It can be pretty safe to assume that, when scrobbling, the US band is being played by people of the English language and particularly the United States, whereas Polish Hurt is more likely to be played by Polish speakers and people from Poland. It won't be a perfect solution but it will stop the two from being combined at least.

I can't even use Last.FM anymore because I get so much Polish crap thrown into my stations. Pandora doesn't have this problem, from the beginning.

Disambiguation by contry/language is senseless. For example , and we have two japanese bands called Vivid.
And Pandora and Lastfm are different.

Админы ластфм - казлы.

[quote][b][user]Sekir[/user][/b] disse: [quote][b][user]Couldtryharder[/user][/b] said: Hi Everyone, those of you who follow closely will know that we've been working with Musicbrainz - see here http://www.last.fm/forum/21716/_/2022989/1 and here: http://blog.last.fm/2011/11/24/the-brainz-are-back-in-town Adrian says at the end of that blog post that "we also hope to leverage MusicBrainz’s experience with handling artist and album disambiguation to improve how we model music on Last.fm" So, I'm happy to tell you this is happening. It's an enormous project that touches many parts of Last.fm, so I can't give you a definite release date, but we're talking about months, not years, until you see the results. Thanks as ever for your patience, and for sticking with Last.fm.[/quote] What does it remind me? Yeah. Fingerprinting [quote][b][user]tomstockmail[/user][/b] said: See: http://www.last.fm/music/Hurt A US band, a Polish band. It can be pretty safe to assume that, when scrobbling, the US band is being played by people of the English language and particularly the United States, whereas Polish Hurt is more likely to be played by Polish speakers and people from Poland. It won't be a perfect solution but it will stop the two from being combined at least. I can't even use Last.FM anymore because I get so much Polish crap thrown into my stations. Pandora doesn't have this problem,[i] from the beginning.[/i][/quote] Disambiguation by contry/language is senseless. For example , and we have two japanese bands called [artist]Vivid[/artist]. And Pandora and Lastfm are different.[quote]

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